At the school bridge club on Friday this hand was dealt without a goulash.

It is all non-vun with south to go first. Im sure most of us agree with a 1D opener and then a pass by West but then what the heck should happen?It is such a freaky hand. (One on which a double doubled slam swing could occur if you didnt notice)

At the table the auction went

Possibly 3D by North but with both majors is it worth taking the risK?

However the real question I wish to pose is what on earth should be bid with the East hand after 1D P P ? Anyone know of any mechanisms which could be used to get across the monster or does anyone have any opinions on what the right bid is?

note time of post

north in my opinion should always bid due to trump fit, nice void and well pre-empting is how to win matches

I rekon 3d is fine and so stop all thought of rebidding with this filth. yeah u have both majors, big deal its not like u really think 4M will be knocked!
If u bid now it tells p what u have and u can comfortably pass after, why make things (like a guess at the 6 level) difficult?

As for risk it bidding, well any worst combination of outstanding cards will knock it badly but genaerally 3D will make and worst down two against their cold game




Getting across this monster is easy!!!!!!!
Double and then:
Over clubs (actual) cue diamonds
hearts cue diamonds
spades bid clubs

Basically continually cue bidding diamonds until p shows u that GOLD Ks and then bid 6 of fit

This hand (N passing)

1D p p X
3D p p X
p 4C p 4D (the MONSTER is shown)
p 4S p 6C

this hand N bidding

1D p 3D X
5D p p 5H (?)
p p p

? = X would just show values and may be passed (bad plan)
use of a double pre-empt (both hands pre-empt the oppo) screws! rho no space to X left!

Have to disagree with Myles I'm afraid

I'd pass with North first time and then, as Catherine always says, 'bid the tickets off it' after you have first shown you are weak. Bidding 3D after your partner has opened and west has passed is just asking for partner to try a horrible 3NT with some sort of 18 count.

As Frazer says, you have both majors, so it doesn't look like opponents have an easy major suit game on. In the Europeans your opponents will be good enough to get around pre-empts like that (lets face it, everyone plays a takeout double!) and they certainly won't be scared of punishing an undisciplined bid.

Myles's first suggested auction (when north passes) seems alright only personally I play michaels and the unusual NT to show specific suits and therefore I could bid 2NT over 1D to show the two lowest unbid suits, clubs and hearts.

This is a great bid in highly competitive auctions because it doesn't matter if opponents take your room away - partner knows your suits straight away. The only problem is obviously when you don't have two touching suits but I've never found it to be a major deal and the advantages outweight the disadvantages - particularly in junior bridge in my opinion.

The second auction (north bids 3D (yugh)) I kind of agree with although it would seem more than likely that west will convert to 5S thinking you have hearts and spades. (You have suggested both majors, only have a doubleton spade and opponents are leaping about frantically in the minors - looks like partner has a 5 or 6 card spade suit to me)

I therefore might be tempted to bid 6C rather than 5H (since 5H-5S-6C is asking to be doubled)

A cracking hand indeed - you should write it up for the SBU news to get something junior related in it.

I was led to belive that in the passout position 2nt should be natural, 20-22. Is this a mistake and should we convert it to being unusual?

I dont think the South hand would rebid 3D, he can pretty much see what is going to happen and would probably jump to 5D in my opinion, just to put pressure on the opponents who almost certinly have lots of hearts.

I think it is partnership agreement Frazer.

I can honestly say in 12 years of playing bridge I cannot think of a time I have been sitting in 4th seat with 20-22HCP and the bidding has gone 1X- P -P - ?

Not sure what the odds are of a suitable 5-5 hand in the same auction but I would guess they are much higher and therefore my opinion is that retaining the same meaning is more beneficial.

Your choice though.

Sorry David, but believe me there will be a time when you will need 2nt in 4th seat to be 20-22 bal that's how most peiople play it. 1nt=10-14, x, followed by 1nt is 15-17, x, followed by 2NT =18-19
I thought 6C was a good 'practicle' bid stops them getting spades into the auction cos your pard couldnt bid them over 1D.
It would be a good hand to put into the bidding panel as they may come up with all sorts of answers and prove me wrong

I aksed John Matheson for comments on these hands and share them with you now.

Hand 259
Should North pass or bid 3D. Playing inverted minor raises 3D=approx.5-9pts and 4+diamonds.If very weak hands were included the range would just be too wide. So I prefer pass.
East's options after 1D P P ? Most experts play 2NT as 20-22 balanced as it helps in defining ranges. A 2D cuebid is now usually played as Michael's,although it used to often be played as any strong 2 suiter.
The practical 6C has some merit,but also has flaws. If we are off AK spades we will not get a lucky lead as South rates to have both. West could have SA or SK,3-5 hearts and say 1club when we want to play 6H.
East is looking at a hand where the odds greatly favour it being his hand,and no need for preemption
So double is possible,but logically 4NT must be UNT,and that seems to fit this hand.
Auction after a double by East
1D P P X
5D P P 5N
P 6C 6D P
P 7C P P
X

5N=massive 2 suiter,C+major as no 2D cue
7C=in freak hands usually bid one more,so North might bid 7D
X= do not lead a diamond

1D P P 4N
5D 6C 6D P
P 7C P P
X